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I can't deny that i have lost some extra "upholstering" since i started dancing about a year ago-ish, and i am liking my body more, a tiny step at a time. This a great thing! In fact, it is one of the thing i love so much about belly dancing...the way it teaches you to love you body and the awesome things it can do! A woman's body is a magical powerful thing. I admire the lean serpentine bodies just as i admire the big curvaceous beautiful belly dancers, and cheer with joy when i see a larger dancers completely DEMOLISHING the preconcived notion that dancers must be thin to be beautiful.
In my Tribal class last week, my instructor brought me face to face with my bare belly.....and i wanted to sink into a crack in the floor and disappear! Tho' i cannot deny that it helps so much to SEE your tummy in action to get a good understanding of which muscles we are isolating when we do various moves. I leave my tum bare when i practice at home, and while i don't ENJOY the view, it is helpful. What i CAN'T understand is why i feel happy pride when i see other POWERFUL non-tiny bellies, yet i can't extend those great feeling of freedom and empowerment to my OWN self. Why am i so hard on myself when i feel so good about OTHER dancers doing the VERY THING i am too chicken to do by putting it all out there!? My big ugly ego gets in the way of feeling good about myself. Even tho' i feel so much better about how i look, i was still mortified to have my less-than perfect midsection out in the open. I felt vulnerable, even tho' it was plainly GOOD to see what my belly looked like while i tired to isolate and such.
Ego is a terrible rotten thing, and self esteem, oh my...it's a never ending battle to "Love" myself and all my faults. Why can't i just say "Screw it", put on a choli and not worry that i don't have Rachael Brice abs! I am tired of struggling with stupid body image issues!
I dearly hope that with time, i will be come more confident and worry less about these issues and allow myself to let go and enjoy the dance without my ego getting in the way! Has anyone else felt this way? Tell me i am not alone and these feelings CAN be overcome.
xoxox button
In my Tribal class last week, my instructor brought me face to face with my bare belly.....and i wanted to sink into a crack in the floor and disappear! Tho' i cannot deny that it helps so much to SEE your tummy in action to get a good understanding of which muscles we are isolating when we do various moves. I leave my tum bare when i practice at home, and while i don't ENJOY the view, it is helpful. What i CAN'T understand is why i feel happy pride when i see other POWERFUL non-tiny bellies, yet i can't extend those great feeling of freedom and empowerment to my OWN self. Why am i so hard on myself when i feel so good about OTHER dancers doing the VERY THING i am too chicken to do by putting it all out there!? My big ugly ego gets in the way of feeling good about myself. Even tho' i feel so much better about how i look, i was still mortified to have my less-than perfect midsection out in the open. I felt vulnerable, even tho' it was plainly GOOD to see what my belly looked like while i tired to isolate and such.
Ego is a terrible rotten thing, and self esteem, oh my...it's a never ending battle to "Love" myself and all my faults. Why can't i just say "Screw it", put on a choli and not worry that i don't have Rachael Brice abs! I am tired of struggling with stupid body image issues!
I dearly hope that with time, i will be come more confident and worry less about these issues and allow myself to let go and enjoy the dance without my ego getting in the way! Has anyone else felt this way? Tell me i am not alone and these feelings CAN be overcome.
xoxox button
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Columbia
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Re: Body image and ego
Sun, May 11, 2008 - 5:25 PMBecause your self-loathing is deeper rooted. When feminism came about, there was definitely a lot of preaching of love thyself, big is beautiful EVERYONE is pretty.
But there is more to it than just that train of thought. We are taught that criticizing out sisters is bad, that we should laud them and give great applause and all that stuff. But we are subconsciously taught to criticize ourselves. And not that your parents shouted you down and called you fat and said you could only get A's in school or you'd be in big trouble. But people often hear from parents and peers "You could've done better" and "I'm disappointed in you" and stuff like that. It keeps sneaking in so that you constantly criticize yourself and can't see the good that there.
Look at how many posts are by women that are pre-qualified by some sort of excuse. "This vid of me I'm posting isn't that good because I was PMSing" "This bra I made isn't as cool as an RB bra" We want praise, and we are proud of what we do, but almost never as it stands up to other people's work.
Here's something to do: Do you have a boyfriend, dudefriend, brother, male person who will be honest with you? Not because I'm sexist, but because of a whole other list of subliminal thought patterns why if a woman praises (or criticizes) you, it won't hit as well.
Take this person, and have them watch you dance. Show them a video of someone of a similar size dancing. Ask them if you did as well, if your similar shapes lend themselves well to the dance. Does your costume flatter you as much? While he may not say your are so totally more fabulous, his words will hopefully be plain and true, without adding fluff to make you feel better. Then you WILL feel better because you will have gotten an objective view from someone you trust to not blow sunshine up your ass. ahem. Ask other people who's opinions you value. It's not fishing for compliments, it's getting an idea of what you do well, and what you need to work on. And by hearing so many views that are neither negative (yours) or fluffy and happy and useless, it will help you to feel what you want to. That you really are talented and just as pretty as that dancer you thought was so fabulous on stage last week.
Oh and by the by: You're not that big. Not even close to big, maybe what one would call not-a-stick. So feel better.
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Re: Body image and ego
Sun, May 11, 2008 - 7:23 PMButton: First, You're beautiful. You may be totally covered in your photo, but I was having a hard time reconciling the photo with your words. You don't look like you could touch afraid-to-show-my-belly with a 10 foot pole. BUT.....we are all our own worst critics. I hope that you will get to the point where you feel comfortable enough in your own skin to wear that choli and hold your head high.
Octavia's comment reminded me of a thread I started in DIY along similar lines: tribes.tribe.net/diycostum...d6cbdc48c4
Best wishes, dear!
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Re: Body image and ego
Sun, May 11, 2008 - 7:53 PMI have 2 body parts that i don't like to show to other people.. One is my belly due to the fact i have a long scar between my navel and, hmm, my errr you know... I've had it since i was 14 years old and it's always been an issue..
So i never ever where low rise skirts or pants... Also given the fact that my belly is so white it sort of glows in the dark too.. LOL..
No matter what you look like or what size you are you have to be comfortable when you dance.. I for one dance for fun so i really love to dress up in that tribal garb!! My dancing is the same even if i am covered up...
In fact i think only showing a little bit of skin is just as sexy too.. You don't have to flaunt it all the time.. I do however think i have a nice cleavage so i do wear low tops and push up bras.. We need to accentuate the "good" parts too..
The other body part i am not too thrilled to be showing off are my knees.. Yes my knees! So i usually wear skirts that are below knee or mid calf.. So the long flowing tribal skirts are just right for me.. So i wear them a bit high on my belly but i do try to show my belly button if i can. And that's about it!!! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Sun, May 11, 2008 - 8:10 PMOne of the things that I watch a lot of women wrestle with is the fact that somewhere along the line their body changed. I used to be a size 5 and I have several friends that were little tiny things at one point, now that we are heavier we are all dealing with a different body then what we remember having, this makes me (sometimes) cringe a little when I see pictures of myself with a bare midriff. Not only are we programed by society, or our parents, but we are also programed by ourselves and sometimes that may be the hardest to undue. For me, I try to focus on my dancing, my technique, posture, timing etc and try to just take better care of myself. This has resulted in some weight loss and better habits and hopefully some better dancing on my part. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 8:06 AMOh God Dian, this is exactly what I'm going through now! I'm 25 now and four years ago I was 130lbs. I'm a good 25-30lbs heavier now and I have a REALLY hard time dealing with that. I know that our metabolisms changes but I'm still really struggling with myself because I still have the image of what I "used to" look like lodged in my head and comparing that with the way I look now depresses me!
On a positive note, I took the very first step to accepting my belly on Saturday when I performed in public for the very first time. It was a little scary and I was a little self-conscious but it really helped to look around the hafla and see dancers of all shapes, sizes, colors, and ages baring their bellies proudly!! Bellydance is so body positive that it has really helped me start to learn to accept my body for what it is NOW and not what it WAS. I'm in better shape now than when I was tiny and I have a great deal more muscle tone but sometimes that old tiny waist still haunts me!! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 11:33 PMWelcome to adulthood, Faedra! :) Many of our society's images of "female beauty" are rooted in the looks of an adolescent: skinny, hairless (armpits and legs), wrinkle-less, fair skin on eyelids, etc., no age spots, no cellulite...
I will be 40 next month; I've gained and lost weight, I've been pregnant, I've had a C-section, I've breast-fed, and I can no longer sustain staying to near-midnight to read stuff on the Internet without looking like it the next day - and my body does not look like it did when I was 21, neither.
But I love what I look like when I'm dancing! :) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 7:23 AMYou know what's interesting about the whole "ideal" is that it's pretty obviously to those of us who have been on the OTHER end of that spectrum that the window of acceptability is narrow as hell. I've gained a bit of weight recently, so I no longer have to deal with this, but I have always been on the end of scathing comments about being "too thin". As in...."GOD...Kim...you are soooooooooo skiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinny!!!" These proclamations were NOT said with anything even approaching admiration. Once, I was asked if I traded legs with an ostrich. This from a male adult when I was about 16. A**HOLE. Why is it okay to ridicule someone for being super thin, when at least some of the people who do so would never in a million years make fun of someone who is on the heavier side of the scale?
What's funny about all of this is that I have actually been side by side with a friend who was two sizes smaller than me and had comments made about how skinny I am. Why? Because my ring finger is a 4 3/4. My wrist is 5" around. I wear bracelets as anklets and can ALMOST wear an anklet as a choker. My bones are ridiculously small, so even though I am no where NEAR the size 3 worn in highschool, I was STILL getting thoughtless comments on my weight.
We're damn if we are and damned if we aren't. And even for those who manage to sit beautifully in the narrow little window, things are often not all rosy. Boys are afraid of them, girls are jealous of them. Where does that leave them?
Who is benefiting from making us all victims of self-doubt? We need to all encourage one another and see the unique beauty in everyone and forget about size.
Love to all!
“There is no excellent beauty that hath not some strangeness in the proportion.” -Francis Bacon -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 8:29 AMMy dance partner and best friend has this problem Nichole!!! People are always commenting on how tiny she is, and how thin and blah blah blah... Her story is one of shock... She was in the bar one evening, in the bathroom, and a woman walked by and said "oh my god your so skinny you make me sick" so she replied back, "oh my god you are so fat it makes me sick" and the woman stopped and thought about what she had just said. It all worked out, the woman realized that she had said something offensive and appologised...
but people dont think that "thin" people have body image issues.
I still think its funny to see my dance partner take on one of her 4 great dane dogs, or all four at once.
We fit tho... I'm tubby and she's thin... somewhere in the middle we fit =) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 11:28 AM"but people dont think that "thin" people have body image issues."
I've noticed that some people appear more comfortable saying things about how skinny someone is to that person's face. I know what my body looks like, I don't like the comments about needing to eat more, being a noodle, etc any more than someone who's heavier needs to hear about their weight. Passing judgement on someone for their body type does not provide for a supportive dance community. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 11:57 AMOh, goodness...I went thru that same thing...and I soooo wanted to repeat that line, at times...(the 'oh, you're so fat, you make me sick')...people don't think about what they say...words can sting worse than blows...
I was always tiny growing up...I'm just under 5'1" and couldn't break 103 lbs, no matter what I did...until I quit smoking 2 years ago and gained up to 124.5...!!! I'm very happy with the fact that I finally don't cringe when I see pics of myself...I never realised how thin I was, unless I saw pictures. I didn't notice it in the mirror...just didn't seem the same.
Thing is, now people tell me that 'you look so much better with a bit of weight on you'...well, hell...I know I was thin, but it's still insulting to tell me that I look better, now...like I looked horrible before...?!?! It's definitely a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.
I'm happy with my body now...even tho I don't have a perfectly flat belly, like I used to...I feel healthier and I think at almost 42, I'm doing pretty damn good...I can actually wear nice bras and have a bit of cleavage...something I never had, before...and I don't have to shop in the children's section to get jeans to fit...which was a toss up, anyhow...cuz kids jeans just don't allow for hips, which I've always had...
My view is that goddesses come in all shapes and sizes...we're all beautiful, because of our differences, not in spite of them...and we can rock those differences and make them our own!!! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 12:10 PM"now people tell me that 'you look so much better with a bit of weight on you'...well, hell...I know I was thin, but it's still insulting to tell me that I look better, now...like I looked horrible before...?!?!"
kinda like: you look so pretty when you put on makeup and fix your hair! What am I, ugly without it? LOL -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 5:26 PM*giggle*...Ex-actly!!! It makes you wonder where people get their ideas of what a compliment is? That's surely not the way to do it. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 5:50 PMMy doctor would be ecstatic if i was a size 12 or 124 lbs!!!!!
I told her the wieght on her chart was too low and it's never going to happen. ... I am "supposed" to weight 137 lbs.. I am about 5 ft 2 inches tall... I asked her if she'd be happy with 160 to 170 lbs and she answered with this comment..
I'd be happy with that if you could keep it off... It seems every time loose weight i put it back and and then some more... Right now i am hovering abouyt 200 lbs... And i am meds for high blood pressure..
Interesting web site here... It says "Did you know: Almost all "ideal body weight" websites use obsolete formulas or tables created in 1979 or earlier "
www.halls.md/ideal-weight/body.htm -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 6:08 PMAs i was typing my last post i was thinking about something Winston Churchill once said..
Bessie Braddock: Mr Churchill, you are drunk.
Winston Churchill: And you madam, are ugly. But I shall be sober tomorrow.
Wouldn't it be nice to always have a witty resposnse when you need one... -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 6:50 PMoh yeah. The french have a lovely expression for that: l'esirit de l'escalier. It means "the spirit of the stairway", or the witty comebacks you think of once it's too late.
(Before I come off all la-de-da, I have to say that I only know that because I read The Sandman comics. I barely managed to make it through college french. hehe.) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 7:20 PMI am so glad this thread was started, I think this is an issue that so many of us share in and I know that belly dance and all the wonderful people I have met through it, has helped me so much. I am heart broken now when I hear other women speak poorly about themselves and I have actually started to accept compliments with almost grace. I actually had two instances last night where I accepted praise for something I made and the way I looked, with no apologies or sidestepping. It's a start. I never really felt like I had many women friends until I started belly dancing, because all the women I have met are so wonderful that I am honored to call you friends. It's very refreshing.
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 8:47 AM>oh yeah. The french have a lovely expression for that: l'esirit de l'escalier. It means "the spirit of the stairway", or the witty comebacks you think of once it's too late.<
I heard this one translated as "the wit of the staircase", but yeah, same idea. Lord love the French and their dead on expressions! :-)
Let's be la-de-da together! ;-)
(I have no idea where I picked this one up, so you're ahead of me on that....) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 10:29 AMI just went to the bodyweight calculator and noticed this: "Women tend to imagine their ideal weight is unrealistically low, so they diet unnecessarily. Men tend to allow their ideal weight to be higher than medically recommended. Men and Women should learn from each other."
Isn't that interesting? Isn't it also interesting that men aren't really targeted by advertising with self-image bombs? They don't wear make-up. They don't struggle to find just-the-right clothes/shoes/fill-in-the-blank. No high-heels. No iron underwear.
Men are judged on their accomplishments (or lack thereof, with a different set of insecurities built in) and women on their beauty (and often on their docility). Why aren't any of us judged according to the kind of person we are?
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Re: Body image and ego
Sat, May 24, 2008 - 4:24 PMNichole-I love Sandman! I have that one.
A few years ago I got a tattoo around my waist as a reminder and a celebration of my curves and femininity. I will never be a tiny woman and so my goal is to stay healthy. I used to have really long hair too & now it's similar to Nichole's. I have my first troupe performance coming up next month & I am really scared to put myself out there but I'm going to do it. We are all beautiful & we practice an art that celebrates that. Remember that joy!
I really like Dove's new "campaign for real beauty". www.campaignforrealbeauty.com
I hope it gets through. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Sun, May 25, 2008 - 9:59 AMWow! That film is stunning! Thank you for sharing it. I just emailed it to my contact list. It breaks my heart. That little girl is so beautiful and so happy and I wonder how long she's going to have that sweet smile as the wind picks up.
I'm sure you're going to kick ass in your performance! If you get a video, I'd love to see it!
(As an aside: I'm confused. Did I say something about Sandman somewhere down the thread that I don't remember? I do love it. Neil Gaiman is a master storyteller.)
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 6:34 AMKathleen, you're my new hero! I checked out the website and now I don't feel quite so bad. I'm still a little overweight according to those numbers but not as much as I thought. Thank you! And the Winston Churchill comeback...hysterical!
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 9:16 PMI'd like to know more about what makes the charts obsolete. I mean, other than being old . . . but is there something we know now but didn't know then about weight and its relationship to health that makes those charts especially un-helpful? I'd always had this idea that older image ideals were more attainable: I'd rather be compared to Marilyn Monroe or Sophia Loren than Calista Flockhart and Paris Hilton.
I feel very good about my weight. According to the calculations on the webpage you linked to, I weigh seven pounds more than what most women my height and age THINK they ought to weigh. That's pretty close, actually. Um . . . hooray me? I wouldn't mind weighing more, if only all the weight would go to my boobs instead of my thighs! :-)
I've heard it said that "muscle weighs more than fat." so I wonder how muscle tone figures into these equations. Personally, I think I gained a whole two pounds of muscle mass in my shoulders when I started belly dancing! So, surely these weight charts do not apply to us! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 11:27 AM"I've heard it said that "muscle weighs more than fat." so I wonder how muscle tone figures into these equations. "
I think not accounting for muscle is part of the problem with these charts.
"The BMI table considers Keanu Reeves, Will Smith and even Brad Pitt overweight. It calculated Sylvester Stallone and Arnold Schwarzenegger to be obese. " http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:Uu_rZZw0Ks0J:www.theeastcarolinian.com/news/20...=2&gl=us
I can honestly say that I am currently overweight both by the BMI chart and by my fat/muscle ratio. However, I weighed the same when I was dancing alot and in pretty good shape. So at this point I listen to my body rather than a chart. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 11:54 AMI told my dh one time that he saves so much time and money being a man...
No Make up, no bra, no feminine times, simple haircuts... Etc Etc Etc
He is fond of this saying... Women are like boats, it's not the hull that costs alot of money, It's all the rigging!!!
And darn it that is true.. Plus the fact that dh only owns about 6 pairs of shoes and a pair iof workboots.. Has 2 jackets he wears and changes them with the season... And he wears only a watch and ring... No jewellry "collection"...
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 7:04 AMwow that website with the charts is really interesting, thanks!
They are right that the first box is waaaaaay too low! I almost choked when I saw the number in there. It also told me that my bmi is currently at 26.6, if I loose about 10 pounds or so I'll be in the healthy range of 19-25. Not too bad I suppose :)
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 12:00 PM<Interesting web site here... It says "Did you know: Almost all "ideal body weight" websites use obsolete formulas or tables created in 1979 or earlier " >
I'm still reading through this thread, but had to stop and make a comment about this...
These numbers for "ideal" body weight are derived from insurance companies and are used to determine how much money they will charge you. The "ideal' body weight for women has actually steadily decreased over the last 30+ years (in the US...not in any of the other Western countries) and the "ideal" body weight for 'men' has slowly gone up.
To sum up...those numbers are BS.
I'm 5'9 ish....I am "supposed" to weigh no more than 145 lbs. I have a large bone structure...and even if I didn't...I wouldn't want to weigh that.
OK...back to the thread... -
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Re: Body image and ego
Sat, August 9, 2008 - 3:00 PM"I'm 5'9 ish....I am "supposed" to weigh no more than 145 lbs. I have a large bone structure...and even if I didn't...I wouldn't want to weigh that."
yeh--- you and me both are in that range yet I weigh now my heaviest EVER, 180#. I've got a gut. blegh.
I hate this body image crap. It kills me! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Sat, August 9, 2008 - 4:27 PMI'm 5'4", very muscular and chubby. I weigh 170 lbs. Hypothyroid, possible insulin resistance, and was being "poisoned by my gallbladder" for a couple of years. I now have the scars from the surgery to add to this. I am working on the scars to make them disappear. they are looking better. I still show my belly. I used to weigh 103, so I hear a lot of "What happened to her? She used to be so pretty." I try not to listen to the people who say that. I just concentrate on being a good dancer, teacher and friend. I did notice that I am slowly getting smaller since my surgery. My body was swelling up before surgery and I even had some fluid accumulation in my lungs. I had never heard of these things happening with gallbladder, but then my dad and sister had the same problems with theirs a month later. Anyway, point being: You are beautiful no matter what "they" say. Teachers that say mean things have a lot more to learn than they can imagine. And, feel good about yourself and the progresses that you have made.... even if you have to run around the house naked for a while to do it! ;-)
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Re: Body image and ego
Thu, May 22, 2008 - 10:08 AMThank you so much Kathleen for posting this. I'm twenty years old and I haven't been to a doctor in two years because of the horrible experience I had last time. It was my first time seeing a new doctor. Everyone pre-doctor was very nice, the took my blood pressure height and weight (the nurse had to stand on a stool to get my height). I am ~5'10 and well over 200 lbs, with near perfect blood pressure. The first thing the doctor did was retake my blood pressure, she couldn't believe how some \one 'as big as me' could have such low blood pressure. The rest of the visit was basically interrupted with snide comments about different diets I should try.. basically the conversation went like this:
Do you smoke?
No
You should try a carb-free diet. Do you use drugs?
No
You should really start eating less. Do you drink?
Not very often
You should eat nothing but boiled chicken
ok.. so it was paraphrased, either way I went home and cried for two hours. Based on the website you posted I *should* weight 183, a far cry from the 145-155 my 'doctor' recommended. At 145 I would look skeletal... Thank you for the confident boost, I still want to loose weight but having a far more realistic goal makes it easier -
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Re: Body image and ego
Thu, May 22, 2008 - 12:12 PMOh my god!! I'd report that doctor for unethical behaviour...
So fire that one and find one you do like.... Hopefully the next one will not be so harsh.. They need to listen to your concerns and ideas.. Did you tell that doctor about dancing? Do you exercise at all? A couple times my doctor has mentioned that if i did loose some more weight she could probably take me off my BP meds and i would not be so out of breathe after i dance.. She reminds not lectures.. And if i am there for an ache or a pain and ask her if i should stop dancing to see if it gets better she says, No Way, dancing is good for you and it's not going to make it worse.. Perhaps i, and my dh are so lucky that we have fantastic female doctor..
ACutally one "diet" that me doctor does recommend is going to Weight Watchers on a regular basis.. It's not a diet, there is nothing you can't have and they are very supportive there... You might also want to consider seeing a nutritionist or dieticain too.. They know way more about eating than any medical doctor does..
I hate to hear stories like yours because it takes aliot of the respect for the profession away.
My mil had an eye doctor who said, the first time he came into the room and layed eyes on her, Your glasses are crooked!
She hated him from that moment on.. There was not "bedside" manner at all... Doctors seem to still be trained to be doctors and there fore don't really have many good interpersonal skills.. Dentists are the same way...
And if you bp is good, you have no heart disease , etc, etc then what is wrong with being 200 lbs when you are 5 feet 10 inches tall...
I am about the same weight and i am only 5 feet 2 inches tall...
When you go find another doctor you should interveiw him... I've done that with specialists too.. And if i don't like them i find another one... If you don't your health will suffer!
My heart goes out to you because no matter what size, shape, age, colour and race nobody deserves to be treated like that... -
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Re: Body image and ego
Thu, May 22, 2008 - 12:54 PMAlecia: There is nothing okay about her treating you like that. If a doctor is concerned about your weight, there are many ways to phrase it without making it a judgement. It sounds like the woman has issues. Please don't let her rub them off on you. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Fri, May 23, 2008 - 5:14 PMNicole: If a doctor is concerned about your weight, there are many ways to phrase it without making it a judgement.
Sadly Alecia's experience is not uncommon. While a physician is educated (one would hope) , too often bias overrules common sense and standard medical knowledge. If they have a personal issue with weight and have pre-concieved notions, they might actually reject everything from medical literature to recent studies that may conflict with their own personal issues. essentially...we believe what we want to hear and physicians are no different. if they have a personal bias against weight, they will let you know whther it is reasonable or not. I, personally, have the opposite problem. I weigh far more than I look and could perhaps drop a few pounds. Despite looking at the numbers from the scale, I have never had a doctor say to me to loose weight. Clearly this is due to a visual perception and bias. The other factor is that many physicians (as well as the general public) believe that if you just eat right and exercise you will be thin and healthy. If only this were true. The public is ignorant and not well versed on medicine but physicians are and when they fixate on a women and her weight then they are no longer effective and should not practice anything remotely resembling a science.
Weight charts are based on statistical averages (and yes...insurance companies shoot low because it is a safer bet) of a general population in regards to health concerns. Many questions arise from this when using statistical data such as ...how big was the sample pool and was the size sufficient to make an accurate analysis? What type of population was tested? Healthy? Unhealthy? Obviously they are basing it on a direct correlation between health and weight which can be a wide range due to too many factors.
So...bottom line is if you feel good and your weight is not a hindrance on your health then it should not matter what size clothing you wear nor what weight you are.
As for dance... a shallow person will look at appearance, an intelligent individual just wants to be entertained. ;) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Sat, May 24, 2008 - 3:43 PM"So...bottom line is if you feel good and your weight is not a hindrance on your health then it should not matter what size clothing you wear nor what weight you are." (Anne Marie)
Say it, sister!
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 10:08 PMDo any of you "tiny" girls have any advice for my daughter? She is just 5 years old, but she is tiny (about 30 pounds); she was below the "chart" for baby weight until just recently (now she's just under the 5th percentile). People comment on how cute and SMALL she is all the time. I want to be a good role model for her, and I guess somehow "defend" the size she is. (If she's like me and my sister, she will never be tall but she'll put on the weight once she reaches "real" adulthood!)
What do you wish your mom had said when people made comments on what a petite girl you were? What do you wish you could go back and tell your 5, 8, 10, 14-year-old self to reply with? (talk about an after-the-moment snappy response! That's down the stairs, out the door, and a few blocks away!) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 6:04 AMHiya: Hmmm.....perhaps you could say something simple like "what does her size have to do with anything?"
Or maybe "I'm raising her to see that size is irrelevant. I would appreciate it if you wouldn't comment on it."
That's a little tougher than spouting off in self-defense, given how you clearly want to be careful about how you word your response to avoid adding to the issue. I hope you find something that feels right for both of you. I wish more moms out there were so aware of how their children might be affected by the carelessness of others.
Dian: Nice job on the compliment accepting! It's crazy how hard that can be.
What do you ladies think it is about bellydancing that promotes self-esteem? The posture? (Hold your head up! Keep that back straight!), the wide array of figures? The oohing and ahhing of other women when they see us dance? (If this is straying too far off topic, I can start a new one put a link to it here.
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 6:44 AMHiya,
As her mom, you are in terrific position to influence your daughter’s ideas of beauty and self-acceptance. An option you could try would be to direct the person’s attention to your daughter’s other great qualities in a positive way. Show them (and her) all of her beauty, not just her physical appearance. This would serve two purposes, to help someone else see her for who she is and look beyond her size; and it would help your daughter value herself, rather than getting an imprint that there is value in being shorter, thinner, etc. than her peers. (It will head off unreasonable expectations about herself as an adult, too.)
Responses to “She’s really cute/small”, could be anything, like, “She’s really smart, too.” Or, “She is very creative; she makes the best mud pies in the neighborhood. They are delightfully messy.” You could tell them (and her) how kind or thoughtful she is. Maybe she helps out around the house or with siblings, acknowledge that she thinks family is important and how wonderful that is. Or maybe she is very loyal or a fast learner or very accomplished. Perhaps she has a knack for explaining things to others or teaching. Maybe she is a great reader or storyteller. Or maybe she is wonderfully curious. Or like you, perhaps she is a talented artist.
To encourage your daughter to appreciate physical attributes, you can compliment her on her features, too. Maybe she has a really cute nose, lovely ears, sweet hands and feet. I’m sure that at five, she has the most beautiful hair color and texture. And, a winning smile (even better, when her baby teeth fall out and she has gaps; or new adult teeth growing in. So cute!) As a belly dancer you can share with her how make up and clothing is about personal adornment and is for your own enjoyment and creativity, rather than trying to impress or outdo others.
If you sew, perhaps you can teach her when she’s ready. Maybe you could use that as a way to teach her how to alter her own clothes to fit, like hemming pants. This way she wouldn’t feel badly about what size a clothing label says, and would value the importance of well-fitting comfortable clothing.
Lots of positive directions you can go with this. Good luck! : ) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 2:51 PMI got alot of comments when I was growing up about my size...I was probably about the same as your daughter...to the point where my mom took me to the doctor...and the old doc told her that 'she'll grow when she feels like it...ain't nothin' wrong with that child'...*giggle*...I loved Doctor Cole...
I also used to have one of our extended family that would tease me and say I wasn't knee high to a grasshopper...or knee high to a duck...but he was one person that I didn't mind the teasing from...cuz he would also say that I was as tough as nails and that I could out fish most of the men he knew...I understood that his teasing was because he loved me...he was a great old man and I still am very partial to his family today...I banter with his son, quite often...he's the same way...he's my favourite cousin...:-)
I did get many worse comments, tho...and they escalated as I got older...everything from shrimp, shortcake, flea...you name it, I got it...until I decided to just go with it...when I finally just laughed at the jokes, they stopped...and I learned to make the most of my size...used to always find the best hiding places when I'd play hide-and-seek with my friends...cuz I could fit in smaller areas...*giggle*
I agree with finding something about your daughter that does not relate to her size and play up on it...I'd be willing to bet that she does great somersaults...and the smile of a 5 year old is a beauty to behold...make her feel good about who she is on the inside and the outside will take care of itself...!!! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 4:39 PMFor all of you who have a smaller number on the height chart: www.shortsupport.org/Researc...ras.html :)
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Re: Body image and ego
Thu, May 15, 2008 - 10:45 PMThanks for the comments and the ideas. For the record (and to practice), she is a great dancer and loves to "teach dance class" (ballet), is learning to read before Kindergarten, has a great sense of humor and a fabulous imagination, is super-friendly, is a great help to her dad in cooking, and is one of my "biggest" fans (see bellydancingmamas.tribe.net/phot...624).
I will not bring up her hair because it is so fabulously curly that it gets commented on more than her size! (bellydancingmamas.tribe.net/phot...060e)
And I wish we had Dr. Cole. M's pediatrician had us come in every month for her first year-and-a-HALF to be weighed, before apparently noticing that I am just under 5 feet tall myself.... -
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Re: Body image and ego
Thu, May 15, 2008 - 10:49 PMDon't know why the picture links go to the album.. .
that's
/c7011f00-2f31-4964-a84a-88c6181ed624 and
/7f0e2a6a-80f5-4d4b-81b6-a769995e060e -
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 26, 2008 - 8:57 PMThe links incorporated the ). at the end of your link into the address, which defaulted it back to the tribe album for some reason. Tribe doesn't handle punctuation around links too well.
Your little sweetie is even smaller than my youngest (who's almost five and about 32 lbs). It hadn't actually occurred to me (being fairly tall myself) that lack of height could be another thing to have issues over... you'd think I'd know better, having enough issues of my own (and objectively, I don't have much to complain of in the physique department... but that doesn't keep me from having a laundry-list of my own pet flaws)
I do worry about the example we set for our kids, though---I have a fairly healthy self-image overall (but there's still that irritating list), but I'm still awfully vain, and my husband has body-image issues bordering on body image dysmorphia (or whatever it's called... the thing where you look in the mirror and see fat where it doesn't exist). He's not happy with himself unless he has 5% body fat and a rippling 16-pack... which is a little hard to achieve without spending brutal amounts of time in the gym. He had the time back when we were teenagers, but at this stage in the game, I'd prefer he chose spending time with his kids rather than at the gym.
Especially since he whines like crazy when I spend that much time on bellydancing... but anyway, I'm getting off topic. Hiya, thanks for giving me something to think about re. my petite wonder. :)
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 1:01 PM"She was in the bar one evening, in the bathroom, and a woman walked by and said "oh my god your so skinny you make me sick" so she replied back, "oh my god you are so fat it makes me sick" and the woman stopped and thought about what she had just said. It all worked out, the woman realized that she had said something offensive and appologised..."
I had a very pretty friend who actually broke into tears one day when another woman told her, "You are so beautiful, we all just hate you." In fact, my friend had deep self-esteem issues because people had been saying that to her all her life!
For me, I grew up thinking it was the nature of females to be bitchy, mean, and jealous. (This led to a lot of self-loathing, too, because I wanted to be a girly-girl, but I didn't want to be a bitch . . . ) All of my friends were guys, because I couldn't be in a room with another girl for ten minutes before she'd start making bitchy comments about my appearance. I had resigned myself to a life without female friends when, suddenly, a few weeks after I got married, I noticed that a lot of the insults had stopped. It's like, the moment I got married I stopped being a threat to them? But other than one very good friend I met in college, I had NO close female friends until I was married. Now I feel more acceptance from other women. I still hear the occasional, "You are so thin, I wish I could be that thin," in a friendlier tone, but I don't get the "I hate you" comments any more.
One of my own acquaintances gave me so much grief about being thin, blond, and caucasian, that one day I just yelled, "Yes, dear, when my soul was standing in line waiting to be born I asked the Creator to make me caucasian, blond, and with a fast metabolism Just To Piss YOU Off. I did it on purpose!" I was especially mad because it happened during a period of time when I had a genuinely over-active metabolism and it was causing health problems for me.
I'm going to start practicing, right now, some responses for the next time someone tweaks me about my size. I don't want to lose my temper and alienate people, so I have to think of rational things to say and rehearse them. The one I can think of now is, "Pardon me, but if I were overweight, would you comment on it to my face? I think it is rude to insult someone's physical appearance." Or perhaps I could just give them a chilling glare and say, "It is rude to insult another person's physical appearance."
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 2:07 PMI'd get feisty and say "What are you picking on me for? You're making yourself look like an idiot" then turn around and be on my way :) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 2:37 PMOh, yeah...the "so skinny you make me sick" comment. I had somehow forgotten about that one. Maybe I just heard it so much I started blocking it. You also have to love "it's no wonder you're so skinny, you eat like a bird!" No, I eat until I start to feel full and then I stop. How did it become a bad thing to not to overeat. I mean, it makes sense that if someone has a small frame that they would need and want to eat less than someone with a larger frame as a general rule.
There are SO many wonderful posts here. I want to thank all of you for sharing. You all rock!
Angelia: I'm really happy to hear that your friend screwed that woman's head on right. I've often wanted to say the same thing to people but have been too wounded by the comment to retort. Good for her! Will you tell her she is one of my new personal heros? :)
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 6:41 AM" had resigned myself to a life without female friends when, suddenly, a few weeks after I got married, I noticed that a lot of the insults had stopped. It's like, the moment I got married I stopped being a threat to them? But other than one very good friend I met in college, I had NO close female friends until I was married. Now I feel more acceptance from other women. I still hear the occasional, "You are so thin, I wish I could be that thin," in a friendlier tone, but I don't get the "I hate you" comments any more"
This is something I experienced too. I've always been large-breasted so I got a lot of those "I wish I had boobs like you do" or "haha, how do you carry those things around" in that catty sniggering laughter way. After I got married, I got a whole new level of acceptance from other women. I'm not sure why the phenomena works that way but for some reason saying the word "husband" seems to completely change someone's view!
As to what I would say to my 10-12-14 year old self: "Don't let a bunch of prepubescent boys make you feel guilty about how you're built" (I got a lot of bra-snapping and attempted pinching when I was a pre-teen)
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Re: Body image and ego
Sun, May 11, 2008 - 8:21 PM"What i CAN'T understand is why i feel happy pride when i see other POWERFUL non-tiny bellies, yet i can't extend those great feeling of freedom and empowerment to my OWN self."
I've been going through the same thing and I understand completely. It's so very easy to cheer on another dancer and find complete beauty in their body and their dance but damned if it isn't amazingly hard to do that for yourself. I'm just now starting to get to the point where I only feel "meh" about seeing pictures/video of myself, whereas before I would simply rip myself apart. I can feel awe for a beautiful 'not-tiny' dancer but I am completely guilty of comparing my body/looks to "Famous Dancer X" and wondering why I can't look just like that.
Maybe we're not supposed to. Maybe we exist because each of us has a mark of beauty that is yet unseen in creation and that's why we all vary physically. Perhaps you (or anyone else really) don't have RB abs because...well...RB's already got them? Start small. Realize that you have beautiful features and take each one into account. Work your way up (or down) to your tummy. I've noticed that pampering myself in small ways has helped a bit. It's hard not to feel a minor amount of affection for your body when you're, say, rubbing lotion all over it right after a nice long shower. Oogle yourself in the mirror sometimes. Do mayas in the mirror.....naked. Check out how sensual the hip action is.
Baby steps, dearie. 'Big Ugly Ego' is a hard thing to push through, speaking as someone who is a loooong way from complete self-acceptance but steps can be made and then, who knows? Maybe you'll find yourself being that dancer that a body-shy woman gets inspired by.
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 5:49 AMMy personal policy when talking to myself is: if I heard the same thing coming out of a friend's mouth, and it would make me feel like she was being a jerk, I have to try my best not to say or think those things to myself.
This goes for body image, but also everything else I would otherwise beat myself up about.
You can already see the beautiful things in the other women around you even if they are not stick thin or 100% muscle. With practice you'll begin to be able to offer yourself the same kindness. Just try to be your own friend. Treat yourself kindly and with respect. Expect the same level of respect from yourself as you would from anyone else.
It takes a lot of practice and it doesn't always work. My advice would be to monitor your internal monologues for bad juju as well as to *get rid of anything you can that is enforcing your negative self image*-- fashion magazines, TV, etc. etc. All that marketing that tries to brainwash us into thinking we are inadequate and we must compensate by starving ourselves and buying shit-- get it out of your life as much as you can. I don't watch TV at all any more, and I haven't bought a women's magazine since I was about 17. I think it's helped me immensely.
You are already beautiful and you don't need to change. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 7:01 AMI second everything Sara said. Nicely put!
I had an epiphany in a gym locker room one day. I was looking around and there was a HUGE array of body types around me. I saw very few women who looked anything at all like we are told we *should* look. We are made to think "average" is about a size 6, when really it's nowhere near that small.
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 7:49 AMThere are all kinds of reasons body image crud is difficult to wash out of your brain. The biggest for me was thinking about body stuff as purely appearance, having some idea of what we're "supposed" to look like and continually falling short of that.
But. Appearance isn't even something you experience about yourself most of the time. How much time do you spend in front of a mirror? How much time do you spend moving, sitting, standing, aching, or just feeling good? A lot more. That was all lead-up to my point: get used to the feel of your belly, of what it's like to move. What it looks like is just a side effect of what it can DO. It's easier to feel without being covered up, and it gets comfortable a lot faster than you might imagine.
PS - A nice thing about the look and feel of tribal is that no one person is the focus, so whatever you might think about the appearance of your individual body, it's more important that it fits into the flow of the group. People generally aren't going to be looking at your one belly, but at all the bellies on stage.
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 8:11 AMButton, I am right there with you. I want to stand up and applaud and cheer for the other BBW's but I want to cry every time I look in the mirror at class. Making peace with post baby and post back injury body is a BEAST.
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 8:16 AMWhile I lack words to solve your problem, I just want to say you are most definitely not alone in feeling this way. I have felt physically "inadequate" since I was 7 years old. I'm almost 21 and the feeling just kept growing. To be honest, a major part of the reason I started to bellydance as soon as I got the money for it was so I could stop thinking about killing myself every time I stood in front of a mirror. Maybe by surrounding myself with people who could care less what I look like and who love themselves regardless of how they look, I could absorb some of it and learn to be at peace with who I am. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Sat, June 21, 2008 - 11:49 AMI hope bellydance has helped you, Laura. I wish I didn't let body obsession ruin my college years, and that I had found bellydance classes at the start of it, instead of the end. But you can't look back. In you ever let the way you perceive yourself affect your personality and life, just fight through. Dance it away! When I'm down, I don't feel like doing anything...but sometimes just turning on some funky beats can lift my spirits a bit. I am 23, and I know I have grown so much from how I used judge myself...nasty perfectionist attitude that I've loosened a great deal. If you work at it, it gets better. There are relapses and hard times, day, but you have to keep going, can't give up on yourself.
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 3:30 PMI had a bit of an epiphany about Body Image a few weeks ago when I went to a vaudeville/burlesque-type event where I ran into some folks I haven't seen in over a year. In the course of that year, due to illness and recovery, I had gained almost 30 pounds and lost my "flat tummy/six-pack abs" that have always been the source of numerous compliments and envy by others.
I was feeling very self-conscious about seeing folks who have always only seen the "super fit" me, wondering if they would be thinking "gee, she really let herself go..." Now, this was all very silly, because letting myself go is the last thing I've done; I've been working my buns off with this Belly Dancing! But yeah, I'm not cut and ripped anymore.
So with that in mind, I put aside my self-doubt and went dressed in my best Belly Dance Fusion outfit and showed off the new and rounder and more talented me.
All night long, I was greeted by a constant stream of compliments on how "sexy" and "beautiful" I looked. How they hoped they looked as good as me when they hit 45! No mentioned my weight gain, no one seemed to really notice.
It wasn't until I came home and began to undress that I realized my "sexy" and "beautiful" self was not my physical body, but my refusal to fall prey to the idea that my old self was in some way better than this new self. This Belly Dance body, far more supple and learned in moves I couldn't touch a year ago. Deeper muscles that allowed me to hold myself proudly and with a power that those six-packs never had. And a light that touched everyone who witnessed my dance of Joy.
Sure, a part of me misses my size 4's and my hardcore, weight training gym days. But a bigger (and better!) part of me has learned to embrace THIS PERSON, who is what people now see, instead of just a flat tummy and killer delts. Besides, that body couldn't do HALF the moves THIS one can!
YYYYIIIIP! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 3:54 PMLa Phox: Thanks for sharing that! You rock! :) -
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 4:51 PMor is that "Raq"?? Heheh.
Thanks, Nicole. It's all about the Sharing =)
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 6:44 PMI love what everyone has said.
and it is all such great advice.
a lot of what effects (or is it affects?) self image is what is 'beat' into us at an early age. We are told and shown since we were kids that skinny or a big chest or whatnot is perfect and beautiful (most prevalently in American culture)... but in reality as long as you are comfortable with who you are, no matter what you look like, you are beautiful.
It is all about how you hold and carry yourself.
As for the encouragement of others, I can imagine that that would be like cheering on your own personal goals, if that makes sense. These women you speak of are dancing and with confidence..and apparently that is something you want to achieve. At least that may be one aspect of it.
I understand what you mean.
On a personal note, belly dancing has helped me gain confidence in myself. I have always been very insecure about my height (Im only 4'10.5") and been very insecure on a more mental level with having had cervical cancer and the surgery to remove the affected area. One may not see it physically, but in my mind a large part of my femininity left...with the loss of hair and the loss of a piece of what anatomically made me a woman. Dancing has helped me reclaim myself from my own self doubt.
What helps (at least for me) is reclaiming yourself as a woman, not caring what anyone thinks of you, and feeling amazing and gorgeous. It is all in how you perceive yourself! You can always also do self confidence enhancing exercises...Like standing in front of a mirror and practicing deep breathing exercises (this releases stress relief hormones.) Stuff like that. And of course, dancing can help! Apparently it has for many people. And i know when i do, i close my eyes and (as cliche as it is) lose myself in dancing.
Either way, be proud of who you are. It may take a while, but it will be worth it in the end. You will see many things in life pick up.
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Re: Body image and ego
Thu, May 29, 2008 - 12:54 PMAmalia,
Sadly enough it's not just the US, I think it's a "civilization disease", this longing for slenderness. I think I was orthorectic (fixated with food and exercise) at the age of 12, and had developed serious eating disorders by the time I turned 15. I've had a long way to not getting anxiety attacks from eating a decent meal or enjoying candy. Now I can even appreciate not being skinny and having a bag-in-box instead of a six-pack. Sometimes I wonder why this happened, and I'm certain I wouldn't have fixated like this if we weren't told to be skinny in every media you could think of. Just imagine Julia Roberts gaining 40 lbs... Bye bye Pretty Woman, that is. And it's so sad. She wouldn't get a part anymore in her life. Skinny= successful...
Actually bellydancing has given me some of my love for the own body (back). It's been better than anything else I've tried, ever. And my students, also those with the rounder sort of body shape, tell me they have a different and improved relationship to their looks now. That makes me so happy. :)
Bellydancing can heal the world. Or at least some of it. While trying, let's enjoy the trip.
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 7:11 AMMy mom, just last week: "Honey, I don't want to go shopping with you. I don't like going into the Lane Bryant and all of those 'Woman's World' departments. I just don't like being seen there."
What a confidence builder, I tell you.....makes me want to go eat a cheese burger to annoy her....LOL -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 7:32 AMGawd...Moms are the worst sometimes! Don't let her push her issues on you. I'm still working hard on all the body issues mom left me with. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Sat, June 21, 2008 - 11:45 AMYea, I have never shown my belly in public until my first solo a few weeks ago at my class's recital. I was wearing a choli. It was so nervewracking for me because I haven't lost 15-20 lbs that I've been working at. I had gained 60, and lost 30...so only a little more to go. I decided to no lose it all because I think I was unrealisitically thin. Well, meaning to maintain that lower weight, I made myself crazy. I have accepted myself for how I look now, which makes it hard to lose this last bit of weight. But I need to. I have Insulin Resistance and dangerously high cholesterol. Anyway, so I deal with health issues, emotoinal eating issues, and body image/self esteem stuff. So I love how I get confidence from somewhere to not only solo, but where a choli exposing my belly....and my mom (who went on a crazy fast diet and is not skinnier than me)...she says "yes, you look like a very sexy bellydancer...but ykno, i hope you wouldnt wear that in public" and another time "you just aren't ready for a bikini, but for bellydance, it's fine" ... o dear. i used to get so offended, but now i try to let it blow off my shoulders. when i get so down on myself, my weight creeps back up.
we need to support each other. we need to love ourselves truly so that we can accept our physical bodies.
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 7:29 AMThis is a terrific thread! Much wonderful input here. I've noticed this huge disconnect between the outward and inward, as well.
I hope this comes across right.
Something else to consider is, "where does the value of having a flat tummy or lean figure come from?" The biggest source I've found is through the media. It's also a product of our society. We receive many, many messages, subliminal and not, that thin and lean is the ideal. In our educated, Western world, somehow "healthy" (in the media's eye) is not synonymous with what is right for any person's frame and biology and that it varies from person to person. They seem to be stuck with the "size 6" on a 5'8" body as the ideal, which is impossible for most of us. Also take into account that within the Western world, that food is readily available and often served in portions that are more than what we need. Conversely, in countries where it is not uncommon to starve to death, being thin, is not an aesthetic ideal, it has a different meaning. In the Middle East and elsewhere, the desireable figure for a dancer, or any woman, is that of curves and voluptiousness. It is considered a luxury and a display of wealth.
I struggle with my body image, as do all of the women in my family. Building a relationship with yourself to feel confident about your body is a process and it takes time. The advice that I can offer (and I need to repeat to myself, too) is, "You can't see your personality in the mirror, and no one else can hear the voice in your head."
Hope that helps!
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 7:55 AMThis is a great thread!
I, too, have lost a bit of padding since I started bellydance...I am in my late 30's and 3 kids away from society's idea of what I should look like. I am, overall, pleased with how I look - most of the time. I still sometimes wish I was "fill-in-the-blank", but then remember that I would not be where I am today or, more importantly, WHO I am today if I was still "fill-in-the-blank."
Which does not mean I do not experience the negative thoughts about body image! Ego is a painful presence sometimes and it can beat the living you-know-what out of self esteem.
My challenges are to stay healthy, both as a role-model for my daughters and to take care of my husband when he's ill. I truly do not want my girls growing up thinking they have to look a particular way - teaching them to love themselves, percieved imperfections and all, has taught me a valuable lesson, since kids tend to mimic behaviors instead of lectures!
Peace, ladies, on your personal journeys to self love and self acceptance!
besos y abrazos,
em -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 8:13 AM"You can't see your personality in the mirror, and no one else can hear the voice in your head."
NICE!!!! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 8:45 AM<hee hee> Thanks!
That's my answer to why we see the beauty in others, but fail to see it in ourselves.
We're all beautiful! Go us!
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, May 13, 2008 - 9:50 AMWow, i am so glad i posted about my feelings on this....everyone's responses have been wonderful and given me SO much to think about.
I think it's been hard for me to "love" my shape because i've changed so much....once upon a time, i was a tiny little pixie sized thing, and in my head i will always look that way, so when i am confronted with the "reality" of my body in a mirror sometimes it's impossible to reconcile the size 12 woman with the size 5 girl! I am not kind to myself, and i SHOULD be! I've had two kids, nursed for a billion years, had a hyster AND quit smoking (which is when the weight REALLY piled on, but, dammit, i am proud of myself for getting that monkey off my back!) So i should honor my body and all it's been through and all that it CAN do! When i really really think about it, i am angry at myself for letting bullshit ideas of beauty dictate how i see and value my body. I am supposed to be smarter and more liberated that that. :)
I can't thank everyone enough for sharing you insights and feeling about this. In the end, i think we are a beautiful, remarkable dancing bodies in motion...it's amazing to be a part of that. Feeling really lucky to be in such company :)
xoxoxo
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Re: Body image and ego
Wed, May 28, 2008 - 12:52 AMi love this topic. i love how open and vulnerable you are with sharing these parts of yourself. and i think you're speaking to something that is so true for so many of us.... and the beauty in how body image and ego can change through bellydance.
will you post this on tribe.net/sattyabody ? Please?
this is just the kind of dialogue and conversation i would love to be able to have over there, and your honesty and inquiry might spark that within the community...
thanks!
deb
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Re: Body image and ego
Thu, May 29, 2008 - 12:39 PMI've experienced that feeling too; the beauty of other women's bodies that are not skinny. And then the yach-ish feeling when the own one isn't slim. The women I think are most beautiful are not the skinny ones, but I require that from myself? I need a "stop kicking yourself course", NOW!!! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Mon, June 23, 2008 - 5:59 PMah...So when i first started dancing with one teacher, I wighed about 50 lbs less then i do now..But I was 15. Now, I have boobs and a butt and a slightly larger tummy. The afore mentioned teacher keeps saying that I need to lose weight, and how pretty I was when i first came to her class. I KNOW I'm a lil chubby...But god. Do you have to tell me that in class? no wonder i don't want to wear a choli.. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, June 24, 2008 - 5:25 AMI can't even believe that your teacher would make hurtful remarks like that!!!! It seems REALLY out of line to me!!!! In class no less? I hope you have access to instructors who will encourage you and help you feel GOOD about your body instead of tearing you down like that, and get the heck out of that class. -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, June 24, 2008 - 7:24 AMAmanda: Since you're in Eugene, it seems like there is probably another teacher you could learn from. One more interested in teaching her students how to dance than in trying to get them to fit her idea of beauty. I can't believe anyone would not see how hurtful remarks like that are. Please don't let it get you down. You're beautiful exactly how you are.
Umay: Have you tried wearing something sheer on your tummy (fishnets or chiffon or something)? A lot of dancers seem to find that a very effective middle ground. It also occurs to me that you could try wearing a top with an open back, like an apron top and gradually narrow the apron until it disappears completely. :)
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Re: Body image and ego
Sat, August 9, 2008 - 4:25 PM"Do you have to tell me that in class?"
NO. She doesnt. And she shouldnt. Please pay her no mind and give yourself five hugs today. Another 6 tomorrow, please. :)
In fact-- EVERYONE do that. And I will too.
Ok?
XOXOOXOXOOXOXOX
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, June 24, 2008 - 2:39 AMI just want to say thanks for this post. I have been dancing for several years now, and still have not showed my belly. My teacher & fellow dancers are very supportive, and keep requesting that I do. Its just I'm still battling myself. I have worn tighter fitting items to help myself make that final leap. I have to say I've never met a more supportive group. Any suggestions on how to make that first small step?
Thanks again! -
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Re: Body image and ego
Tue, June 24, 2008 - 1:39 PMHey Unmay,
Why don't you try wearing a shirt that has vertical cut outs first? That way you're showing skin but still covered up..And you could try wearing a sheer/fish net one nderneath the cut out one if that helps any..lol I might have to try that...
Everyone else -
I'm stuck in her class..I don't have a job at the moment so I can't afordanyone else's class ( my current teacher does it for free..)...Unless Some one knows a teacher in eugene who wolld trade dance classes for fire poi classes lol.
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